@bender@twtxt.net Nope not at all. base64 just encodes more bits

Build what makes you happy. Let miserable people build the rest

@lyse@lyse.isobeef.org I think the proposal should be as simple as this:

• Update the Twt Hash extension.
  
• Increase its truncation from 7 to 12
  

@xuu is right about quite a few things, and I’d love it if he wrote up the dynamic hash size proposal, but I’m inclined to just increase the length in the first place mostly because my own client yarnd doesn’t even store the full hashes in the first place 🤦‍♂️ (I thinnk)

@xuu Good point.

@xuu I guess @movq@www.uninformativ.de ’s point is there isn’t one that is available as standard on OpenBSD? 😅

here are plenty of implementations https://www.blake2.net/#su

I mean sure if i want to run it over on my tooth brush why not use something that is accessible everywhere like md5? crc32? It was chosen a long while back and the only benefit in changing now is “i cant find an implementation for x” when the down side is it breaks all existing threads. so…

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Necropost: btw i have twt alias for twet 😅

@bender@twtxt.net Yes, a proposal alone is certainly not enough, but a good start. Absolutely necessary in my opinion. With everything just in thin air and constantly changing (at least it appears to me that way), I’m lost.

I have the feeling that the hashing part is the most important one that should be sorted first.

@lyse@lyse.isobeef.org I agree. Yet, even with a proposal, it is hard to finally agree to something, because it is not about developing a unique, sole client, but agreeing on a set of “standards” to be used on a handful(?) of clients, make by different people.

Using Mastodon as a—albeit poorly—contrast, they set their road-map, and clients (even other server implementations!) that want to cater/communicate with it using similar APIs will have to adjust. No other way. That doesn’t apply to twtxt.

I think the incremental changes that have been made to twtxt happened kind of slowly for that reason.

@quark@ferengi.one I definitely agree with the first part. Not so sure about the second one. Maybe it then turns out miserable, too. :-?

@fastidious@tilde.town @movq@www.uninformativ.de hehe’ Howdy!

@bender@twtxt.net I do hope that it ends up fancy! But maybe it turns out rather crappy. Metal working is definitely beyond my capabilities. I just find it super fascinating.

I’d also appreciate if somebody wrote a proposal. It’s very hard to piece everything together across all those many conversations.

@prologic@twtxt.net yeah, sad, convoluted, dangerous state of affairs for just about everyone. :-(

@bender@twtxt.net Not yet! the prompt said the requests are treated manually and that it could take up to 30 days.

@bender@twtxt.net yeah I know, I treat these like the RSS ones. I’m OK with them being one-ways as long as they don’t get Spammy.

@aelaraji@aelaraji.com so, did you get approve? What’s your tilde?

@aelaraji@aelaraji.com a one way only feed? I can’t see the twtxt you are referring to, but checked the original feed, and they seem not to be engaging with anyone.

@prologic@twtxt.net is base64 more desirable than base32? I noticed I get alphanumeric replacing base64 with base32.

@3r1c@3r1c.net 🤔 Interesting! I was thinking about doing something like this in Rofi, now I can just play with this one.

e.g:

$ printf "%s\t%s\t%s" "https://example.com/twtxt.txt" "2024-09-29T13:30:00Z" "Hello World!" | sha256sum | awk '{ print $1 }' | xxd -r -p | base64 | head -c 12
UWVFdUXtvoLS

@bender@twtxt.net I’m inclined to agree. @xuu needs a bit of convincing maybe? 🤔

@prologic@twtxt.net I would think we would want to make it as easy as possible. I would favour something that’s most widely and readily available, won’t you?

@movq@www.uninformativ.de Curious, is our goal to have readily available tools on every possible system? 🤔

@bender@twtxt.net To be fair it really isn’t sha256sum vs. b2sum. Neither is more complicated than the other.

@movq@www.uninformativ.de that is it! Thank you! In comparison, sha256sum is much less complicated. :-D

@bender@twtxt.net The example @prologic@twtxt.net posted is missing the base32 dance and the length should be 256 instead of 32. This thing prints the correct hash:

printf '%s\n%s\n%s' 'https://example.com/twtxt.txt' '2020-12-09T15:38:42Z' 'The twt hash now uses the RFC 3339 timestamp format.' | b2sum -l 256 | awk '{ print $1 }' | xxd -r -p | base32 | sed -E 's/=//g; s/.*(.{7})$/\1/' | tr '[A-Z]' '[a-z]'

(xxd is part of Vim.)

@prologic@twtxt.net indeed. The batcat package under Ubuntu doesn’t install one.

@prologic@twtxt.net I’m sure you can somehow install something that calculates blake2b on OpenBSD. But it’s not part of the base system as a standalone CLI tool, there only appear to be Perl modules for it. The other SHA tools do exist.

@bender@twtxt.net So it should be possible to install man pages in one’s home directory👌

@prologic@twtxt.net you set the MANPATH and man pages install on that location. I found the man page for Ubuntu 24.04, and got it installed now: https://manpages.ubuntu.com/manpages/noble/man1/batcat.1.html

@bender@twtxt.net Yea but what about non-root?

In Linux all man pages are under /usr/share/man/. Packages build, and install, their own man pages. Now bat is one of those odd ones that doesn’t.

@bender@twtxt.net Hmmm 🤔 Where do you put man pages outside of the contest of a package manager? 🤔

@bender@twtxt.net Not sure. It might be a slight variant. I’ll find out 🙃

@bender@twtxt.net Oh I hope that is true 🤣

It bothers me that some tools (namely bat) do not come with their own man pages. I think it goes against the Unix philosophy.

@prologic@twtxt.net the resultant hash doesn’t look anything close to the hashes being used today. Is b2sum generating something else, or what?

@prologic@twtxt.net why sorry? For all we know @movq@www.uninformativ.de won the lottery, and is retiring in Tasmania. :-P

@movq@www.uninformativ.de sorry to hear about your personal things going on. 🤗

@movq@www.uninformativ.de I don’t think that matters a great deal. I think you should publish your client anyway because I think the direction that will end up taking will hopefully be one that we collectively agree on. 🤞

@movq@www.uninformativ.de is that the only system is not available on? Are there alternative packages for OpenBSD?

@prologic@twtxt.net I was about to post the same a few days ago, but b2sum is a GNU thing and not available on OpenBSD, for example.

@prologic@twtxt.net I wanted to wait for things to settle down. It’s still unclear to me in which direction we’re going – and if that new/different stuff is even possible to implement in jenny. That said, I’ve been really busy with private stuff these last few days, I’ve lost track of most of what you’re discussing. 🥴

If we stuck with Blake2b for Twt Hash(es); what do we think we need to reasonably go to in bit length/size?

=> https://gist.mills.io/prologic/194993e7db04498fa0e8d00a528f7be6

e.g: (turns out @xuu is right about Blak2b being easy/simple too!):

$ printf "%s\t%s\t%s" "https://example.com/twtxt.txt" "2024-09-29T13:30:00Z" "Hello World!" | b2sum -l 32 -t | awk '{ print $1 }'
7b8b79dd

I am told through various sources that Iran decided last night to attack Israel with over 200 missile strikes in response to Israel attacking Lebanon. 🤔

@bender@twtxt.net sorry wat?! 🤣

@bender@twtxt.net at this point, I wouldn’t use anything but Signal or Apple messages 😅.